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Hogweed – 10 hours ago »
I have such a sad life that I spend about 10 hours a day watching telly, so this is important to me… so I actually have a Freeview box too, to be able to record 3 or 4 channels at once on the rare occasions I need to.
Anyway… I watch MasterChef (I know, I know, the shame…) and am recording the current series on the Panasonic Freeview box. First thing every morning, I go through the day’s programmes (and the next day’s) on both boxes, and set programmes to record as required.
Obviously, when I started recording MasterChef, I selected the “Series Record” option – but just now I noticed that, although tonight’s and Friday night’s episodes are set to record, tomorrow’s is not.
I don’t know anything about CRIDs, but I’m guessing the information is broadcast and used by both Freesat and Freeview?
If so, maybe this is symptomatic of the problem we’re discussing…?
Better check all your planned series recordings anyway 🙄
The system is actually not that complicated and basically uses just two codes (CRID).
A single CRID code that is the same for every episode the broadcaster decides is part of the same series ( for fairly obvious reasons kknown as the Series CRID).
A second CRID code unique to each episode in the series.
When you set a series recording the box finds the first programme in the epg that matches the series CRID (it Might be before the one you set the recording from). Once that has recorded the box scans the epg for the next programme with the same series CRID but a different Programme CRID (avoids repeating recordings already made). This continues for 13 Weeks after the last recording is made, at this pont the recording reservation is auto deleted.
On top of this the system allows the broadcaster to dynamically control the box to start recording and stop when the programme actually starts and stops (AR – Accurate recording).
grahamlthompson – 13 minutes ago »
Hogweed – 10 hours ago »
I have such a sad life that I spend about 10 hours a day watching telly, so this is important to me… so I actually have a Freeview box too, to be able to record 3 or 4 channels at once on the rare occasions I need to.
Most Humax boxes are able to display the CRID codes by utilising a hidden menu setting.
Anyway… I watch MasterChef (I know, I know, the shame…) and am recording the current series on the Panasonic Freeview box. First thing every morning, I go through the day’s programmes (and the next day’s) on both boxes, and set programmes to record as required.
Obviously, when I started recording MasterChef, I selected the “Series Record” option – but just now I noticed that, although tonight’s and Friday night’s episodes are set to record, tomorrow’s is not.
I don’t know anything about CRIDs, but I’m guessing the information is broadcast and used by both Freesat and Freeview?
If so, maybe this is symptomatic of the problem we’re discussing…?
Better check all your planned series recordings anyway 🙄
The system is actually not that complicated and basically uses just two codes (CRID).
A single CRID code that is the same for every episode the broadcaster decides is part of the same series ( for fairly obvious reasons kknown as the Series CRID).
A second CRID code unique to each episode in the series.
When you set a series recording the box finds the first programme in the epg that matches the series CRID (it Might be before the one you set the recording from). Once that has recorded the box scans the epg for the next programme with the same series CRID but a different Programme CRID (avoids repeating recordings already made). This continues for 13 Weeks after the last recording is made, at this pont the recording reservation is auto deleted.
On top of this the system allows the broadcaster to dynamically control the box to start recording and stop when the programme actually starts and stops (AR – Accurate recording).
Thanks for that, very interesting. So I guess the Beeb are broadcasting the AR thingy to stop some of my programmes before they actually finish – and, last night, to start recording a couple of minutes into the programme – so there’s little point in my setting “padding” at the start and finish, as it’s being overridden.
I’ve noticed that my customary series recording of Casualty on Freesat, and MasterChef on Freeview have both excluded this Saturday evening’s episodes.
What a shambles.
If padding in minutes is set then it will overrise accurate record totally. Padding will cause conflicts in some situations. I never use it as, except with the current BBC problems, AR generally works very well.
REPASSAC – 1 minute ago »
If padding in minutes is set then it will overrise accurate record totally. Padding will cause conflicts in some situations. I never use it as, except with the current BBC problems, AR generally works very well.
Hate to disagree when you presumably know what you’re talking about, and I certainly don’t… but over the last few days, I set padding of 2 minutes at both start and end, and it still lost the end of a couple of recordings.
Hogweed – 18 minutes ago »
but over the last few days, I set padding of 2 minutes at both start and end, and it still lost the end of a couple of recordings.
Could you quote the name of the program, channel, date and time please. Setting padding very definitely doesn’t guarantee anything and there are plenty of circumstances where two minutes padding is not enough.
Hogweed – 1 hour ago »
REPASSAC – 1 minute ago »
If padding in minutes is set then it will overrise accurate record totally. Padding will cause conflicts in some situations. I never use it as, except with the current BBC problems, AR generally works very well.
Hate to disagree when you presumably know what you’re talking about, and I certainly don’t… but over the last few days, I set padding of 2 minutes at both start and end, and it still lost the end of a couple of recordings.
Padding looks at the scheduled start and end times and adjusts the start recording and end recording times to exactly that. The broadcaster no longer has the capability to adjust the start and end times and as the box wakes up at the set start time rather than 15 mins or so before there is no way that the broadcaster can start the recording earlier than the padding adjusted start time. eg With 2 mins start padding a programme starting 3 mins earlier than scheduled will lose 1 min at the start. Scheduled programme duration doesn’t usually vary much. Most issues arise from late or early start deviations from scheduled times.
Basically if the start and end padding isn’t large enough to cover transmission deviations from start and end times you still lose content.
Martin Liddle – 56 minutes ago »
Hogweed – 18 minutes ago »
but over the last few days, I set padding of 2 minutes at both start and end, and it still lost the end of a couple of recordings.
Could you quote the name of the program, channel, date and time please. Setting padding very definitely doesn’t guarantee anything and there are plenty of circumstances where two minutes padding is not enough.
Sorry, I didn’t keep a record – but I do remember one of them being a 3-part documentary about Europe… hang on, will see if I can find it on iPlayer… right, “Inside Europe – Ten Years of Turmoil”, broadcast on 28/1/18, 4/2/19, and 11/2/19. As far as I can remember, it missed the end of all three. BBC1HD I think.
grahamlthompson – 2 hours ago »
Scheduled programme duration doesn’t usually vary much.
I beg to differ; News programmes and Sports programmes quite frequently change their duration and often at very short notice.
Martin Liddle – 9 minutes ago »
grahamlthompson – 2 hours ago »
Scheduled programme duration doesn’t usually vary much.
I beg to differ; News programmes and Sports programmes quite frequently change their duration and often at very short notice.
I never record News or Sports content. It’s extremely rare for anything else that is pre-recorded and not live to vary at all (Why would they ? )
The programmes mentioned as failing here certainly don’t fit in the live content category.
Quick check on my 5000T currently has 594 recordings, none of them fit the category except perhaps the Brit Awards (which recorded fine. Wouldn’t you say 594 to 1 fits the great majority ? 😳
grahamlthompson – 44 minutes ago »
The programmes mentioned as failing here certainly don’t fit in the live content category.
An earlier programmes over-running can have an impact on the programmes follwoing it regardless of the category.
Quick check on my 5000T currently has 594 recordings, none of them fit the category except perhaps the Brit Awards (which recorded fine. Wouldn’t you say 594 to 1 fits the great majority ?
I most certainly wouldn’t agree; you are assuming that your recording habits are the same as everyone else.
Martin Liddle – 1 minute ago »
grahamlthompson – 44 minutes ago »
The programmes mentioned as failing here certainly don’t fit in the live content category.
An earlier programmes over-running can have an impact on the programmes follwoing it regardless of the category.
Quick check on my 5000T currently has 594 recordings, none of them fit the category except perhaps the Brit Awards (which recorded fine. Wouldn’t you say 594 to 1 fits the great majority ?
I most certainly wouldn’t agree; you are assuming that your recording habits are the same as everyone else.
No I Am not. Those who do record these sorts of programmes will have similar issues in that they impact on scheduled recordings most likely on the same channel due to follow the end of the live event. The scheduled recording transmission fails to record due to the over-run of the live content. That fact alone doubles the risk of a failed recording, the failed recording duration remains the same.
In this situation padding is completely useless there’s no way to predict when the live event will finish, only a manual recording with a start time after the live event has actually finished will record but how would you know what to use as a start time, if you get it wrong and the live event is still being transmitted it will fail due to a recording clash. If you have a programme set to follow a live event, far better to look for a repeat within the epg and use AR to record the repeat showing.
grahamlthompson – 1 hour ago »
The scheduled recording transmission fails to record due to the over-run of the live content. That fact alone doubles the risk of a failed recording, the failed recording duration remains the same.
I agree; it is exactly the point I was making in my previous post. Your position has changed from “Scheduled programme duration doesn’t usually vary much.” to accepting that variations in programmes you don’t record can change the start time of the type of recordings you are interested in.
In this situation padding is completely useless there’s no way to predict when the live event will finish, only a manual recording with a start time after the live event has actually finished will record but how would you know what to use as a start time, if you get it wrong and the live event is still being transmitted it will fail due to a recording clash.
I am certainly not advocating padding and have never used it. It is irritating that at the moment the BBC are getting it spectacularly wrong at the moment. The new at 1pm on BBC1 was cut short by about 12 minutes today.
Martin Liddle – 1 hour ago »
grahamlthompson – 1 hour ago »
The scheduled recording transmission fails to record due to the over-run of the live content. That fact alone doubles the risk of a failed recording, the failed recording duration remains the same.
I agree; it is exactly the point I was making in my previous post. Your position has changed from “Scheduled programme duration doesn’t usually vary much.” to accepting that variations in programmes you don’t record can change the start time of the type of recordings you are interested in.
I didn’t say that a previous programme can’t change the start time of a follow on programme only that it will not affect the duration of the follow on recording which seems to be a 100% accurate observation.
Not just the BBC (but mostly) – I had it with a UTV programme last night
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